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Patch 3.3 Background Download, Shadowmourne - No Hunters, Blue Posts

#1 User is offline   WoRBot Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 12:10 PM

Patch 3.3 Background Download

It looks like the background downloader for patch 3.3 is now running. This doesn't necessarily mean it's coming next week, but soon is a good way to look at it. A lot sooner than Blizzard's typical "soon" timeframe. This is the enUS version of the patch as you can see; players in Europe will see a download of around 482mb.

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Shadowmourne - No Hunters

I guess Blizzard changed their mind since BlizzCon, because there is no hunter version of Shadowmourne.

Quote from: Valnoth (Source)

The quest requires friendly Ashen Verdict rep to begin. It may also only be acquired by Warriors, Paladins and Death Knights.

Blue Posts

Icecrown frostwyrm mounts (Source)

There will be a Frostwyrms up for grabs for Icecrown raiders, achievable in a similar way to previous rewards such as the Ulduar proto-drake.

Chill of the Throne (Source)

The "Icewell Radiance" is designed to account for very high avoidance levels. It lets us lower the damage bosses do per hit because their hits will connect more often, keeping boss dps the same but lowering spike damage.

However, I also know what that message says to some people. It says that if I go into Icecrown and wipe on a boss all night that Blizzard lied to me about boss damage. We're just sort of bracing ourselves for the inevitable "I couldn't beat Marrowgar because he hits so hard. I thought bosses wouldn't hit hard."

Bosses hitting less hard does not mean bosses can now be facerolled. It just means they hit less hard. To be fair, most of the folks posting in this thread understand the difference. But it's not uncommon for us to see our quotes misused in other forums where we can't necessarily bop in to correct the misunderstanding.

Druid

Feral items in Cataclysm (Source)

We talked about druids in bear form also getting AP from strength. Strength won't appear on leather and no piece should have Str and Agi together, so it's not like they would really double dip. That lets us still have tanking necks, rings and cloaks with strength on them that are attractive to all 4 tanking classes.

Almost all the items in the game are going to have to change. In many cases this is just a sweeping pass we can make on all gear, such as replacing the Agi + AP on leather with just Agi. So don't worry too much about what happens with old gear and talents mixed with the new stat system. The gear and talents in many cases must change.

Mage

Fingers of Frost (Source)

The Fingers of Frost issue is really challenging to solve. It it procs on hit then the procs don't get eaten but you may have to interrupt a Frostbolt. If it procs on cast, the procs can get eaten. Those are really the only ways it can proc though. Mixing travel-time spells and instant spells can muddy things up. Things also get more complicated when you have silly amounts of haste, which through no fault of their own, many mages do.

Fingers of Frost seems to work fine so long as you have Frostbite, but due to some technical limitations, the two talents don't play well apart. A long-term solution might be to make Frostbite a prereq for FoF or just merge the two talents together.

Letting Fingers of Frost display its charges is a good idea. We might not be able to get that in for 3.3 but we'll put it on "the list."

Rogue

Weapon swap addon in 3.3 (Source)

We also killed the addon, but we didn't want to do it without also trying to fix the problem it was trying to fix.

Shaman

Elemental tier-9 nerf (Source)

We don't want players to stick with older tier sets when new pieces become available. (It's one thing if it's a really good trinket -- it's another if it's your entire set..)

We balance some things around absolute values (we're shooting for a target) and other things around relative values (how X looks compared to Y). A lot of shaman were saying they weren't going to upgrade to tier 10 despite the, frankly, gratuitous stats on the new gear. We concluded that was because the T9 set bonus was too good and the T10 set bonus was too weak. We suspected the T9 was too good for some time, but didn't want to nerf it while the T9 was all that was available. We did the same thing with a few other sets (or relics).

We try to pick interesting set bonuses, but that means that they will sometimes end up being over or under-budget once players figure out the best ways to optimize their play style around the bonuses. A little of that is okay -- it's interesting when a new set changes your spell rotation a little bit. But when an older set is so good that players feel like upgrading is a bad thing (ignoring the pain of having to get new enchants and gems or whatever) then we think we have a problem.

From a player point of view, I can understand why the attractive answer is always just to buff the new stuff. But continually buffing an outlier instead of bringing the outlier back into the pack is a good way to lead to power inflation on gear.


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#2 User is offline   marlance Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 12:31 PM

Just started the background downloader on eu version, it was 475 MB.

The extra 27 MB we get in Europe is language packages for Spanish and other non English realms I guess?
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#3 User is offline   Kody Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 12:52 PM

Yep.
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#4 User is offline   Xentropy Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 12:58 PM

Surprised to see them nerfing shaman T9 but boomkin T8 2-piece is still enough according to my boomkin friend (functionally +15% damage forever) to continue to wear 2 pieces of T8 instead of T10, much less T9.
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#5 User is offline   lejeuneking Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 12:59 PM

Shadowmourne being a hunter weapon was a joke by Blizzard. It didn't come off that well because the days of hunters taking every weapon possible, like in vanilla, are over. Sometimes blizzard isn't to good at making it known that it was a joke.
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#6 User is offline   Sparkledoom Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 02:24 PM

It's been well known that the "hunter weapon" thing was a joke for about two months. Frankly, I'm surprised that comment was even made on the news page.
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#7 User is offline   marlance Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 02:28 PM

Has there been any comments from blizzard about shamans and Shadowmourne? Maybe 2h and shamans is long gone, dual wield is the only way to go in both pve and pvp?
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#8 User is offline   Kody Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 02:37 PM

Sparkledoom said:

It's been well known that the "hunter weapon" thing was a joke for about two months. Frankly, I'm surprised that comment was even made on the news page.


Really? :)

[quote=Ghostcrawler in Ghostcrawler - Please confirm on SHADOWMOURNE]
Anyone capable of using a two-handed axe can use Shadowmourne.

The stat allocation may not benefit hunters or shamans as much as warriors, DKs or paladins.


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Lead Systems Designer (Source)[/quote]
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#9 User is offline   Sprinky Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 03:37 PM

Xentropy said:

Surprised to see them nerfing shaman T9 but boomkin T8 2-piece is still enough according to my boomkin friend (functionally +15% damage forever) to continue to wear 2 pieces of T8 instead of T10, much less T9.


Yep Id like to mention the boomkin 2pc t8 bonus also. There are no items currently in game that can make up for losing the bonus and it concerns me that I will still be wearing those items up till lvl 85.
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#10 User is offline   thephoenix3000 Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 03:56 PM

Kody said:

Really? :)


Yes really, farther in that post he even said it was a joke.

http://forums.worldo...35760&sid=1#171

Quote

There was a slide that said "Behold Shadowmourne."
This was followed by a slide of an orc DK holding said axe.
This was followed by a parenthetical that popped up a moment later that said "hunter weapon, obviously."
The crowd laughed.

I'm sorry if that did not translate well for our viewers at home. :)

I know some of you take this game very seriously, but Blizzard has always held a touch of humor in high regard. Please don't deny us the ability to be sarcastic or make the occasional dumb joke.

"Gauging the health of a game by reading its forums is akin to gauging the health of a community by visiting its hospitals." - Ghostcrawler quoting someone else.
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#11 User is offline   Leviathonlx Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 04:06 PM

thephoenix3000 said:

Yes really, farther in that post he even said it was a joke.

http://forums.worldo...35760&sid=1#171


He didn't say whether or not it was a joke that anyone that can wield 2 handers can use it and only that the 'hunter weapon' (or statted for hunters) part was a joke.

This post has been edited by Leviathonlx: 19 November 2009 - 04:42 PM

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#12 User is offline   Kody Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 04:40 PM

thephoenix3000 said:

Yes really, farther in that post he even said it was a joke.

http://forums.worldo...35760&sid=1#171


"hunter weapon" is an age-old joke and is what he was saying, otherwise he wouldn't have said what he did initially in the thread.

People were up in arms because they were concerned it would be optimized for hunters, so he clarified that.
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#13 User is offline   chaos986 Icon

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 04:45 PM

Back to Tier Bonus Nerfing 2-Piece tier 7 is still amazing because it is straight 5% Damage to pet not rating. I cannot afford to lose that bonus until 2pc each of 8&9 (+10% Damage to Serpant Sting that can crit!)
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#14 User is offline   EnderAsha Icon

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Posted 20 November 2009 - 10:53 AM

The Boomkin set bonus is an issue of a novel idea that was blown up due to oversight. They increased the bonus when you could only have one eclipse so it provided roughly a 3% dps increase then once you were able ot have both it was now a 5-6% dps increase as a set bonus.

Now blizzard has stated that quality set bonuses should yield between 2 and 3% dps increase. Given that, you CAN break your 2 piece tier 8 if and only if you are swapping it for another set bonus that is worth 3% dps AND the increase in gear quality yields an additional 3% dps bonus.

A decent amount of the higher end raiders have dropped 2 piece tier 8 for 4 piece tier 9 if the pieces they swapped in to replace them were the ilevel 258 set pieces. That doesn't make any sense from a design standpoint that we are forced to hold back on gear until a massive upgrade that is only available to a small subsection of raiders.

Either they bake that 3% damage into the moonkin base sometime, improve leather caster gear as a whole, or do something else to fix it.

Not playing a shaman i don't know how imperative their tier 9 set bonus is but if it's anything similar then I know how they feel

edit: For a hunter, a bonus that increases your pet's damage by 5% doesn't seem that impressive. Your pet would need to do over 50% of your total damage output for that bonus to yield even a 3% damage increase. Currently, i guess if you're beastmaster it yields maybe 1.8% damage bonus?

This post has been edited by EnderAsha: 20 November 2009 - 11:23 AM

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