Wrath just might be too easy...

WoRBot · 11-21-2008, 03:39 AM

The merged Nihilum and ex-SK Gaming guilds have defeated Sartharion the Onyx Guardian with all three drakes up, completing an achievement which was supposed to be impossible until later tiers of content.

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Chrono · 11-21-2008, 03:40 AM

Blizz fails at balancing content...

Discuss.

Wusho · 11-21-2008, 04:01 AM

Yeah i agree blizz does suck at balancing raid content i mean look at ZA at 70 it was intended for t5+ guilds and yet u had guilds who are barely clearing kara in a week going threw and running threw it likes it nothing hell a well balanced pug could run threw za and get all timers ive done it its not hard to do i still dont think they will down arathas anytime soon tho id say about a month

D0rk · 11-21-2008, 04:11 AM

While I'm a bit hesitant to call the content too easy until another group can perform similarly, I can certainly say I will be sorely disappointed in Blizzard if they deliver something so easy after the success of Sunwell.

Mordiceius · 11-21-2008, 04:15 AM

You have to remember that Nihilum and SK were farming this content on Beta. It is not like they walked into Northrend not knowing anything about any of the bosses. To them, this was all just another raid lockout.

koenigsegg · 11-21-2008, 04:20 AM

Who can tweak anything good enough so both TwentyFifthNovember and less super-duper-rofl-hardcore guilds can clear it aswell?
How many % of all guilds do Blizzard wan't to be able to clear those on heroic? 0.01%? 1%? 5%?
I don't care until I see other guilds clear it on heroic mode and all drakes up.
I can admit that heroic 5-mans are to easy. Have not set my foot to Naxx yet, but Naxx should be cleared the first/second day for the "supa-dupa" hardcore guilds and some weeks-2 months for less hardcore.

As said, ignore TFN or we'll get dungeons that are way to hard for every casual out there. Let them get boring and leave the game or something.

Mordiceius · 11-21-2008, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by koenigsegg

Who can tweak anything good enough so both TwentyFifthNovember and less super-duper-rofl-hardcore guilds can clear it aswell?
How many % of all guilds do Blizzard wan't to be able to clear those on heroic? 0.01%? 1%? 5%?
I don't care until I see other guilds clear it on heroic mode and all drakes up.
I can admit that heroic 5-mans are to easy. Have not set my foot to Naxx yet, but Naxx should be cleared the first/second day for the "supa-dupa" hardcore guilds and some weeks-2 months for less hardcore.

As said, ignore TFN or we'll get dungeons that are way to hard for every casual out there. Let them get boring and leave the game or something.

Exactly! The hardcore are a dying breed. Let them die. I want everyone to be able to see these and do these raids.

Kody · 11-21-2008, 04:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordiceius

You have to remember that Nihilum and SK were farming this content on Beta. It is not like they walked into Northrend not knowing anything about any of the bosses. To them, this was all just another raid lockout.

I have a hard time believing this. The difficulty is intended to be about that of Ulduar or probably a bit harder than Ulduar with the drakes up. That alone says something isn't right when it's beaten after a single lockout, in level-up/Sunwell/level 80 dungeon gear.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordiceius

Exactly! The hardcore are a dying breed. Let them die. I want everyone to be able to see these and do these raids.

This isn't a hardcore vs casual debate. This is a barely tier 7 guild defeating an encounter that's supposed to be on par with tier 8 (or possibly harder than tier 8).

If this was done in two months after everything has been farmed to death, I'd be less surprised and/or annoyed by it. But not a week after release.

Mordiceius · 11-21-2008, 04:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kody

This isn't a hardcore vs casual debate, so don't even bring that in here. This is a barely tier 7 guild defeating an encounter that's supposed to be on par with tier 8 (or possibly harder than tier 8).

If this was done in two months after everything has been farmed to death, I'd be less surprised and/or annoyed by it. But not a week after release.

This is also a guild that has flawless execution in everything they do. They took the best from the best two guilds in the world.

I would be surprised if they didn't get it in the first two weeks.

It will still take the average guild many many many months to ever accomplish this.

Fatirish · 11-21-2008, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordiceius

Exactly! The hardcore are a dying breed. Let them die. I want everyone to be able to see these and do these raids.

I like when people say stuff like this.. because they don't know what its like to actually earn a kill.

To go into a new zone like sunwell where the boss fights are unique and difficult, where it requires a specific raid make-up and proper consumables, its just more engaging. To be able to steamroll content after a few attempts though, its just not satisfying.

Why must people labelled ''casuals'' think that hardcores are just TRYING too hard..? It's what some people do in a game, they strive to be the best and if they succeed, its even more satisfying.

The reason i would never want everyone to see the raid content i've worked hard to down is because it makes it feel less special. With sunwell, it was even a slap in the face to have other guilds downing m'uru after 2 pulls when it took about a month of wipes to get him down properly. Sure its great that they get to see the content.. but it feels as if they didn't properly earn it.

Mordiceius · 11-21-2008, 04:49 AM

Pre 3.0 I was 3/6 Sunwell. I know what it's like to raid there. The thing is, the days of raids of that difficulty are over. Raid stacking in such away was just dumb. Making every encounter boil down to "did you bring enough shamans and drums" is not a good instance.

Leviathonlx · 11-21-2008, 04:51 AM

It was obvious 2 months ago that beating the encounter with the drakes up wasn't that hard as long as you knew what you were doing. I am unsure of when it was said that beating him with the drakes up was supposed to be on par with Ulduar or higher (I'd guess it was said at Blizzcon or whatnot) they just said it was meant for higher tier guilds. A guild with full Sunwell gear and a lot of raiding experience qualifies as a higher tier guild in the beginning 80 raids.

Pepperwolf · 11-21-2008, 04:59 AM

i honestly dont think its "too easy" ... the problem i think is the "gear requirement" ...

sunwell gear is absurdly overpowered compared to what you find until 80 (talking about ganking a lvl 70 mage, while i'm 75 and being 3-4 shoted by him, and yes, he was full on sunwell gear)

if you fight the content with greens / blues that you get through lvling (what the content is originally tunned for) its not that easy and "any dumb monkey can do it" .. and they can't possibly have lots of t7 gear since they had only 2 raid resets so far, so mostly, everyone have 1-2 itens of t7 range .. i bet more than half of their gear is sunwell range ...

most people that i see "doing naxx" or farming heroics, are from guilds that farmed bt/hyjal/sunwell for months ... i'm not seeing people with greens/blues doing that, if i see, then i'm worried ..

well, i saw the same thing back in BC, people with naxx gear wore it until after KZ ... the difference is that people or guilds with full naxx gear, was something quite rare to find .... sunwell gear, i can name at least a dozen guilds on my server that had it on farm...

my ret pally still have WAY MORE gear at 70 than my dk that's nearly 76 ..

edit: and i think its funny when people think this is "wrong" .. if i remember well, BT patch came ~3 months after BC release, and they downed him in the 2nd week, basically took them 1 week without much previous testing, to down the "big bad ass" of BC .... and basically 1 year passed until sunwell came... i hope they enjoyed killing illidan more than 50 times in the meanwhile ...

Eulo · 11-21-2008, 05:00 AM

It was brought up at BlizzCon and I think they cited a figure of a couple months for when they thought the best guilds would be able to do it. They made it sound as though it was supposed to be as much a gear check as it is a coordination check.

Kirmm · 11-21-2008, 05:00 AM

This endgame progress they are doing is insane and somehow saddens me.

Do you remember the time when the best guilds were spending months on one boss? Those were the days...

Sad.